Apple Remote Desktop Issues

[#1]

Hi,

Our school district is a new Casper client. I've used Netrestore for
several years now but the powers that be in the district decided (with the
help of the consulting firm) that Casper is our future. I can see that once
we get the kinks worked out that it will be helpful but right now, with all
the issues that are happening, I'm getting frustrated. I don't know whether
the problem is within the product itself or the way the consultants have set
it up or the scripts the consultants have put in place to "make it work." I
have many problems with this "process" right now but here's my top one right
now.

Has anyone had the issue where after using Casper to image a computer
(Intel iMac, 10.5.8) that you cannot see the computer via ARD? I can see
the IP address in my scanner listing but not the computer name (which is in
the JSS). The other thing that happens is that I can sometimes see the name
but when I try to observe/control it via ARD, the authentication screen pops
up for a nano-second then goes away and I have no way of connecting via ARD.
One of the most maddening parts of this problem is that of the 10 computers
I've imaged with the same image on the same hardware in the same method,
four worked fine with ARD, 2 won't let me connect and the other 4 computer
names do not display in ARD.

I am not a big fan of the VNC interface used with Casper Remote and
would really like to get this ARD working and working consistently. The
consulting firms will not give us any more assistance to resolve the
problems that existed even while they were here until they get another PO
(funny how that works) and the powers that be want these new iMacs out. Any
suggestions that anyone has would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

Emilia Treglia
Technology Support Specialist
Scotch Plains- Fanwood Schools

[#2]

We've experience issues with ARD and the authentication screen popping up for a second and then disappears.

I think this is a "bug" in ARD. Go to the All Computer group and search for that IP (it will probably show another computer there is that offline). Then delete that computer from ARD. Now try adding back that computer and you should be able to authenticate and then control.

We see this happen the most when one machine grabs the IP that was previously used by another.

See if that helps with the authentication problem. Not too sure what is going on with the ones without their names if you are imaging them the same way with mixed results.

Travis

[tlarkin]

Did ARD ever work after imaging? You have to actually turn it on, on the client side. I have a preflight script that I wrote that enables the ARD client for some specific local accounts. Also, the ARD fields, those get populated by either Casper or a script as well. In my ARD admin (3.2.2) and with my Macbook Deployment (10.5.8) I can see the IP, the name, and the current user who is logged in.

It works actually rather well. I must assume there is a configuration issue with your set up. Could you explain your imaging process to us? The problem is not Casper, or OS X, but really just a configuration issue as I have been doing exactly what you are trying for a few years now with Casper.

Thanks

Tom

[taugust04]

Actually it's a better idea to look for the computer by mac address, not IP. This is a bug in ARD where part of ARD believes the computer has never been added before, while another section of it believes the computer you are trying to add is already there and a duplicate. I think the bug involves how databases are being read by the ARD Admin Console. Sometimes a restart of ARD or the computer resolves this issue on its own without having to look for a computer to delete. Other times you have to go in and find the "duplicate" computer, delete it, then try and add the computer again.

-Ted

[tlarkin]

I've had my problems with ARD but I haven't really seen this before. I guess I am lucky?

[stevewood]

I too haven't had any problems with ARD being functional after imaging using
Casper Imaging. I have, however, experienced in ARD where a computer will
show up twice: one being available and the other being unavailable. What I
have been able to determine is that the particular machine has two
connections open, Airport and Ethernet, and ARD has a hard time with this.

I think this is where the bug lies because the machine may have been added
via the Airport interface, but then later added again via the Ethernet
interface. I'm not certain there is a way, or if you'd even want to, to
tell ARD to use only a certain interface on a client machine.

As Ted mentioned, it might be a better solution to search by MAC address. This would be fairly simple to do, as the data would be in the JSS.

And perhaps, as Tom mentioned, you could list your imaging process, because
it sounds like some things may not be correct. I am of course referencing
your comment about how the consultants had to "make it work" with some
scripts. You will find those on this list are very helpful and
knowledgeable when it comes to Casper. I am sure we can help you sort this
out and have Casper do more than "just work".

Steve Wood
Director of IT
swood at integer.com

The Integer Group | 1999 Bryan St. | Ste. 1700 | Dallas, TX 75201
T 214.758.6813 | F 214.758.6901 | C 940.312.2475
Sent from Dallas, TX, United States

[John_Wetter]

We’ve also used this same setup and ARD has worked like a champ. As Tom mentioned, we likely won’t be able to help any more until we hear what your process is or what some of those specific scripts are doing that you mentioned your consultants have you using. Let us know how you’re using Casper and we’d be happy to help.

We usually use the VNC console as we’ve had problems with ARD in our large environment with it updating clients even with a task server so the VNC has worked well for us. I understand some of the nice parts of ARD though as well.

John
--
John Wetter
Technology Support Administrator
Educational Technology, Media & Information Services
Hopkins Public Schools

[#8]

First of all, I'd really like to thank all of you who have made the time to
respond so quickly. I'd also like to apologize for what might have sounded
like a negative opinion of Casper. When those consultants (who have done
work for us in the past) first described Casper and its capabilities over a
year ago, my immediate response was 'where do we sign?' I hope that I can
get that feeling again...

Our setup is such...the consultant set up a brand new Xserve dedicated to
Casper. We're running 10.5.8 on the server and have recently upgraded our
Casper to 7.1. For our Mac environment, we are running Tiger (10.4.11) and
Leopard (10.5.8) on PPC and Intel. Our teachers each have their own
laptops and we have mobile (Macbooks) and stationary labs (in the schools,
all of which authenticate through AD and OD and are managed through
Workgroup Manager on that same server running Casper.

As part of the scope of work, the consultants created the base OS and most
of the packages originally but many had to be remade by me as they
discovered that we seemed to need a different version of the packages and OS
for the different hardware and OS versions. That was just part of the
learning curve but thankfully it gave me a chance to get myself further
involved with Casper. The scripts to get things to 'just work' were brought
in by the consultants who are both brilliant (and really nice guys) but were
way overstretched in not only deploying Casper but their other installations
as well throughout their expanding client base. The 'just work' scripts
were created to automate such things as using info from the JSS to create
computer records in Workgroup Manager and even put them into groups. They
also wrote a script to enable ARD since it was initially not enabled in the
base OS package and we need ARD not only for me to administer/provide tech
support the nearly 1000 members of my Mac family in 8 locations but to allow
teachers in the lab to keep an eye on their students using ARD management.
So, that was a very welcome script. Most of the other scripts provide
things like login delays, disabling infrared, changing login options,
disabling bonjour (which is hear would be bad for Snow Leopard?), enabling
root and these run as part of the imaging procedure after the application
packages are installed.

For imaging, I've created 'Casper Central' which has a gigabit switch
connected to the same switch as the Casper server. I hook up all the
computers to the switch and then select the image. The consultants have
advised me that the system works best if you utilize the randomization
features so I get them all set up to go and then scurry around hitting
'install' on all of them at one time. Once the imaging has completed (it's
about an 8 GB image which goes wonderfully quickly especially when it's
compiled, thank you Casper), it reboots and then launches a consultant
written script into which I put information such as the username, location,
type of computer (lab, admin, laptop) of the unit and then once it finishes,
it logs itself out and in many cases, it's a happy ending.

The 'smart configuration' that I was using for these computers (20' iMacs)
utilized the base leopard configuration that the consultants had set up and
which has been used as a base for my other Leopard computers without this
problem. My only addition was an updated Firefox package. I even tried it
without the updated package and still had the problem with ARD. I guess
what is most frustrating about what happened is that in 10 identical
computers using the same image being 'Casperized' at the same time, 4 are
very happy with ARD, 2 would not let me authenticate (which another terrific
list member helped me solve) and the last 4 would not even register with
ARD. I can deal with something not working, it's when it's a hit or miss
problem that makes me crazy.

I hope I've given you enough information without putting you all to sleep.
Thank you again for all your help. Hopefully once we get past these growing
pains, I'll be able to help other newbies solve problems too.

Emilia

-- Emilia Treglia
Technology Support Specialist
Scotch Plains - Fanwood Schools

[tlarkin]

If you are using OS X Server, you can accomplish a lot of this with just
using MCX. You can set group, user, and computer group policies to
force certain things on or off, or alter the menu bar. That way you can
ditch some of the scripts and not have to worry about maintaining them.

[Bukira]

Yes i like the combination of Casper, WorkGroup Manager, iHooks and
Growl, with a bit of KeyServer thrown in. I personally think you need
more 1 one solution and need to be able to mix,

I prefer workgroup manager to Casper's mcx I prefer growl to Casper messaging For some situations i prefer iHooks to Casper login hooks and Growl And i prefer KeyServer for license management and logging, i prefer the
reports it builds for logins and software usage.

So you really need to experiment with different things and find whats
best for you with the knowledge you have access to.

Criss

Criss Myers
Senior Customer Support Analyst (Mac Services)
Apple Certified Technical Coordinator v10.5
LIS Business Support Team
Library 301
University of Central Lancashire
Preston PR1 2HE
Ex 5054
01772 895054

[tlarkin]

When I went to the CCA training a few years ago in Chicago, I remember
learning a very valuable lesson. You see, I am the type of person that
will script and command out everything, because it is easy for me to do
so. We were running through an exercise where a package was broken on
purpose. I zipped through the lesson and just did a few Unix commands
to change ownership and permission and bam I was done and it worked. However, Wudi, in his infinite wisdom showed me that is a bad practice. The next guy won't have a clue what I did to make it work. So really,
the best method is to go back and make it simple and make it work from
the beginning instead of trying to fix it in post scripts.

Just something to think about.

-Tom

[donmontalvo]

Yep...like we say in our neck of the woods...process before technology.
Thomas Larkin tlarki at kckps.org wrote:

Don

[jarednichols]

I remember that lesson... yes, the "right" way was to repair the package rather than fix it afterwards. However, I think there's a lot of value in scripting things. Right tool for the job sort of thing... Scripting isn't bad, just use it carefully and of course, comment your scripts.

j

[#14]

Agreed. I have always done so much of that via the server but the
consultants, in their well meaning attempt to make things "easier" for me,
felt differently. In true fairness to them, they've since told me that they
perhaps should not have tried to script as much as they had especially
knowing that I'm very comfortable using the server tools. I'm hoping that
once I become more comfortable with Casper (and after I get these iMacs
deployed), I can find the time to delve into each script so I can make
changes or even delete them and revert to using the server tools. Of
course, somewhere in there I'll also have develop a Snow Leopard image too.
Thankfully, I now know I can look to this list to see what those who have
gone before me have encountered. :)